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| Gary Mcsheffrey | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mar 15 2010, 01:54 PM (968 Views) | |
| mattsgottheblues | Mar 15 2010, 01:54 PM Post #1 |
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James McFadden
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I know he's at Leeds on loan but he's hardly settin the world on fire over there, there was talk earlier in the year of him going to Sheff W/Utd (can't remember) for around £500000 which would mean a massive loss. Anyone in the "know" as to what will happen to him, I've got some friends (well workmates) who are Cov fans that would kill to have him back. |
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| B25 YEWTREE LOYAL | Mar 15 2010, 01:58 PM Post #2 |
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Alex Govan
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Likely to be a financial loss regardless of who he signs for.....another victim of Steve Bruce and his poor coaching staff.Killed his natural instinct in the Small Heath triangle where goalscorers disappear :banghead: |
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| nastynafti | Mar 15 2010, 02:00 PM Post #3 |
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Peter Enckelman
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he was quality when he first signed. seemed to hit a brick wall just after christmas and didnt look the same player. |
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| tommii | Mar 15 2010, 02:20 PM Post #4 |
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Peter Enckelman
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I think his contract expires in the summer, so will be let go. Is a shame as I remember being at the Preston Home game and he scored a hat-trick. He was on fire!!!! Then nothing.... |
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| ohhhnurse | Mar 15 2010, 02:43 PM Post #5 |
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Frank Worthington
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Not Brucies fault e became rubbish, that is a well worn statment that is said of many managers...the player just becomes useless in a higher league. |
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| poppa999 | Mar 15 2010, 02:57 PM Post #6 |
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Mikael Forssell
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When we were in the Prem last time, McSheffry looked like a child playing with grown ups. He had no strength, no speed, no guile. He was in the wrong league. Coventry is about his level. |
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| B25 YEWTREE LOYAL | Mar 15 2010, 03:16 PM Post #7 |
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Alex Govan
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each to their own...he had a natural instinct for goals and it was coached out of him to such an extent he couldnt even score in the bl**dy championship..his confidence was shot having to compensate for poor left backs :angry: |
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| poppa999 | Mar 15 2010, 03:44 PM Post #8 |
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Mikael Forssell
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Murphy's law? |
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| jj22 | Mar 15 2010, 03:59 PM Post #9 |
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Kenny Burns
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Didnt he have problems with depression? |
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| bluenosedave | Mar 15 2010, 04:15 PM Post #10 |
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Bob Hatton
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I think McSheffrey was another one of Brucie's poor judgement in players......he tended to buy players from championship clubs and below based on how many goals they get for their respective clubs and McSheffrey, Neil Danns and Clinton Morrison are examples of these (although I thought Clinton didn't do a bad job as the worker in a front pairing to be honest, but that wasn't why he was bought). Likewise Brucie bought from the ?Prem based on reputations and, on a lot of occasions, got it wrong there also.....Gronkaer, Butt, Dunn and Heskey all spring to mind there (again Heskey could be seen to have been unfortunate due to him being asked to play a lone striker role) If I was a manager I'd want SB as my defensive coach, but I wouldn't let him touch the attacking side of the game! Unfortunately SB's chasing of McSheff and the first 6 months of his blues career created a standard that he couldn't maintain.....going to Leeds could be the best thing for him, if they get promoted and he plays regularly it will be a confidence boost and being back in the chamionship with no real expectations could give him the license to perform again. Prem was just a step too far for him I think! |
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| cotswold chris | Mar 15 2010, 04:26 PM Post #11 |
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Steve Claridge
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You are so right about SB's appaling record with attacking players. Did you read the comment he made a couple of weeks ago baout sunderland's tendency to play route one hoof ball? He said he couldnt understand why they kept on doing it...."its not as if we coach them to play that way". What a laugh! Heskey any one? And a certain famous french internationa[ star asked why the ball never came to his feet, always in the bloody air! At least AM tries to encourage the ball to be passed along the ground. |
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| jj22 | Mar 15 2010, 04:28 PM Post #12 |
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Kenny Burns
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After Bruce signed him, his 1st season for us earned him the reputation as one if not THE best player outside the PL. So at that stage would of been considered a great signing.....how could a manager acount for his form dropping so badly! Its too easy to look back in hindsight and judge like this cos like i said after a year he was considered a great season. Im pretty sure he had problems with depression which kept him out of the frame for a period and obviously affected his confidence. And you say he is best off as a defensive coach?He has one of the best strikeforces in the PL and brought players like Forsell and Dugarry to the club!! |
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| Des | Mar 15 2010, 04:46 PM Post #13 |
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Malcom Page
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B25 I think if you look at the stats that he had his most effective goalscoring burst ever while at Stans! Unfortunately he sadly wasnt prem quality, hence Leeds Wednesday & Cov being the teams interested in him! kro |
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| bluenosedave | Mar 15 2010, 04:58 PM Post #14 |
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Bob Hatton
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Yeah but Sylvan Ebanks Blake was thought to be the best player outside the prem last year and he's not done it this, likewise Clinton Morrison, likewise Michael Chopra, likewise...need I go on? Making that step up from championship to Prem is nowhere near as seemless as some people imagine! Dugarry already had the reputation when he arrived and I'd wager that SB fell on his feet with that one and was 'tipped off' about his availability long enough before anyone else could sniff around cause, lets face it, name me a club outside of the then big 4 who wouldn't of been interested; even then, as impressive as it was, it was only a cameo for half a season. Forsell wasn't even on the radar, it was only by luck that we found ourselves in the far east tournament with newcastle and chelsea that Forsell came to light as being available. Let's not forget that the two players mentioned had their best spells for us on loan as well! I do feel sorry for McSheffrey, I don't think he's that bad a player, I just don't think he has what's needed to make the step up to the prem (certainly not as a wide player, plus he was unfortunate that Lazaridis was still a recent memory!) and I don't think he was possibly handled correctly by SB when his performances dipped. The fact that I don't hear the Leeds fans shouting his name would seem to bear out that he's a championship player at best. |
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| jj22 | Mar 15 2010, 05:49 PM Post #15 |
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Kenny Burns
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Youve listed a few players who couldnt make the jump but look at this seaons signings.....Johnson and Dann! It was said Steve Bruce's forward signings were all poor, iv listed 2 good successes and you have put them down to being lucky!! How do you think most managers get players, they obviously have tips offs from someone as with playing the same day as most teams its hard to watch lots of other games! And Lazaridas was not that much of a great player to be over shaddowed by was he? |
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| tony123 | Mar 15 2010, 07:43 PM Post #16 |
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Alex Govan
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He's fair player but not worth the 4m we spent on him simliar to story to Morrison who was made out to be the next best thing but never quite scored enough. He just never quite fit in to thrive at Blues. He tried but just didnt work out for him. He just wanted suited to us under Bruce. I think Bruce goes for talent slightly before working out how he is actually going to fit them in. McLeish tries to blend better than Bruce. How will the player work within the team. He appears to have a preference for UK/Irish born players if possible which I heartiliy agree with. The closser to home the players the more like they are to naturally gel into a single unit. |
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| SuttonBluenose | Mar 15 2010, 10:00 PM Post #17 |
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Geoff Horsfield
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even more of a loss when he leaves on a free to leeds! |
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| JamieFromBrum | Mar 15 2010, 11:57 PM Post #18 |
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Jose Dominguez
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He seemed to of lost form the moment the pitch started to look like Twickenham.. then we got Promoted and never hit it in the Prem.. Can't moan about Bruce signing him for god sake though, he was quality at first.. Don't remember anyone moaning when he was scoring for fun.. and we got promoted didnt we? Think the person who mentioned depression was right too, although i've heard worse than that.. Obviously wouldnt be fair to start throwing theorys around. |
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| bluenosedave | Mar 16 2010, 12:10 AM Post #19 |
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Bob Hatton
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They've settled well and made that transition, they're defenders! It's naturally easier for defenders to make that transition. Plus they're 2 centre halves having been picked up from the championship by a manager who was a centre half, the same as SB. Let's not forget that SB picked up Upson out of obscurity in Arsenals reserves and took an educated gamble on the likes of Cunningham and Vickers not yet being passed their best as some other managers had done! Comes back to what I originally said, if I was a manager I'd want SB as my defensive coach (including his input on signing defenders!) but I still wouldn't want his input on strikers!
Never said he was lucky! I said that he most likely had earlier notification of Dugarry's availability and was able to more or less conclude negotiations before anyone else could jump in and that he just happened to be in the right place at the right time to obtain Forsells services. That's how football works sometimes! If you want to look at strikers on loan that proved to be poor loan deals shall we talk about Dwight York, Chris Sutton, Andy Cole, Pandiani.....can't quote 2 relative successes (and remember Duggary was effective for half a season, Forsell for one season) and discount the failures because, as hard as this might be for you to accept, Bruces failures with strikers far outweigh his successes; the flip side is though he's been more succesful in his defensive purchases which comes back to my original post!
If I was a striker gambling on a winger getting to the byline and delivering I'd be more likely to gamble on Lazaridis doing it! Also if I was a right back playing against either of them I'd prefer to play against McSheffrey because I know that he's at his least dangerous if I show him outside and down the line, Lazaridis I'd have known he had the speed down the line and the ability to deliver but could also cause me problems if I let him cut inside as well. If your asking me which one I'd choose to have in my team it would be Lazaridis every day as he offers far more options than McSheffrey. That's why Lazaridis was a Premiership player, not to mention a regular international,for 90% of his careeer and McSheffrey isn't. If you're looking at this as being a SB v AM debate then you're looking at it from the wrong direction, AM's ability to make the right call on a striker has yet to be decided but should become clearer once next season starts, given AM's managerial experience though I'd back him more than I'd back SB in the transfer market. |
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| gladimnotavillafan | Mar 16 2010, 12:22 AM Post #20 |
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Kenny Burns
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Can't believe someone doesn't rate Stanley for all he did for us. Have a butchers at our first season up in the prem to watch it in short. |
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| jj22 | Mar 16 2010, 03:14 PM Post #21 |
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Kenny Burns
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That season McSheffrey had in the Championshiop was better than any season Lazaridas had for us.....large periods of TF's management he couldnt get in the team. And i think if McSheffrey was Australian he would of played for Australia so you cant really say that, cos while its a great achievment playing for your country some are a lot easier to play for! Yeah you are right about the forwards but in general it is easier to sign better defenders as you are paying less money so can aim for better ones.......if your looking for top forwards its going to be way over our budget!Look at TF his defensive signings were better than his attacking ones even though he was a forward. And you are right AM's signings have been better than SB's so far. |
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| bluenosedave | Mar 16 2010, 04:16 PM Post #22 |
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Bob Hatton
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Only because the goals McSheffrey scored actually clouded over the overall contribution to the team, plus it was a short lived contribution.....Lazaridis overall contribution gave more to the team than McSheffrey did; not only that Lazaridis proved he could maintain that contribution in the premiership (both for West Ham and Birmingham). The choices that TF made are more down to TF than Lazaridis, don't forget he quite often opted to play Bryan Hughes wide right plus he had G-man supplying deep crosses with that trusty left foot of his. As for the international side of things, to play down Australia's ability at that point in time is a little derogatory to them, don't forget they had the likes of Viduka, Kewell, Brett Emerton, Mark Shwarzer....not to mention that Lazaridis last few games for Australia would have also included the likes of Tim Cahill and Lucas Neil. To dismiss Lazaridis's 60 odd caps in that sort of company is a little disrespectful in all honesty. McSheffrey may or may not have made the grade, internationally, if he had of been australian but I don't think he'd of dislodged either Lazaridis or Kewell on that right side in that, in that time period anyway, and he certainly wouldn't have been versatile enough to play right back like Lazaridis did on a lot of occasions. Looks like we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one **thumbup |
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| tarrantini | Mar 16 2010, 04:18 PM Post #23 |
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Bob Hatton
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His best mate is Michael Doyle who is at Leeds on loan from Cov, and thats the main reason Gary went there. |
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| jj22 | Mar 16 2010, 05:34 PM Post #24 |
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Kenny Burns
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You know you say Lazaridas and Kewell play right midfield and Lazaridas even played at right back........Do you mean Left? And doesnt Lazaridas playing at full back show how weak the national team were?Im not being disrespectful to his international achievment but i dont think they even qualified for a world cup during his time did they? When players from the Australian A-League are getting in the squads doesnt say much does it?Robbie Fowler is playing over there and is a star player!! Where i do agree with you though is Lazaridas gave far more to this football club than McSheffrey did but in terms of best seasons of the 2 Mcsheffreys promotion winning season was surely the best one off season? |
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| PartisanBCFC | Mar 16 2010, 05:38 PM Post #25 |
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Jack Wiseman
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What utter tripe You're forgetting he played in the Premier League as a teenager for Coventry , years before joining us McSheff was a good player and during the last relegation season, there was no way he was one of our worse performers.....The Boxing Day game v Boro he was Man of the Match , also the home game with Man Yoo where Ronaldo bamboozled the very slow Queudrue for the only goal of the game That long term injury has knocked himn back a peg if anything He'll sign for Leeds if they come up and will score goals for them I'm one fan who appreciates what he did for us but I also sense he had fallen out with Alex McLiesh over team selection and opportunities......Lots of players will sulk when they cannot get game time......Nothing different about McSheff :applause: |
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2:49 PM Jul 11